Semi-dedicated Isn't What It Used To Be

[Sabi]

Yes, I am on Neon as well and it seems you and I are experiencing the exact same issues.

My guess is that everything was fine until cloudlinux was installed and rather than the proper load balancing that was taking place, our resources are now being arbitrarily limited per user with no real concern for "time of day" load balancing. We are basically back to "here is your little slice of the pie" shared server model, which from my perspective, defeats the entire purpose of SDX.

I'm certainly willing to pay a little more for extra resources but when I inquired about moving up to an appropriate level of VPS, I was told this..



If that is the case, why would anyone choose a $49.00 VPS plan when a $19.95 SDX plan is more powerful?

Can anyone please explain this response? It makes no sense to me.

Thanks!!

Scotty, I'd make this simple and transparent. I'd as the tech. how much RAM and CPU do they think my site is using. Then just take the RAM figure, add 370MB to it and get a cpanel VPS with that much of RAM. I'll bet you troubles would be over.

Should that not be enough, just get nginx installed and i'm sure you would be okay for the next 24months.

[Ron]

VPS gives total control and root access, SDX is shared hosting with extra resources beyond regular shared hosting.

I believe the upgrade paths are:

For power:
Shared -> SDX -> HYBRID -> Dedicated.

For control:
VPS -> HYBRID -> Dedicated.

HYBRID may not have been in the power path before, but now with cloudlinux and resource limitations on SDX, and the very limited number of users on HYBRID and the fact that HYBRID is fully managed and comes with CPanel, I think it is. Your mileage my vary and support might beg to differ with me. If so, go with support's opinion.

[JPC-Catalin]

When I started my own game forum, it has been hosted on a VPS server (had root access and the ability to install anything I wanted). When I saw that the traffic increased and my memory/CPU was too high I bought a Dedicated server. It was a big step, a lot more money to pay but now I'm very happy. In my opinion, changing all the plans is a waste of time, a lot of downtime (especially if you have custom configurations) and more work each time you switch and a lot of clients/visitors leaving you.
I have a few years in the webhosting industry and I must say that more then half of the clients I've been worked with don't take in consideration what I suggested. They say that the server is bad, they don't need, they don't want, they'll be leaving us! Ok ... so here they go .. new webhosting company, new rules, new restrictions, website down again, let's upgrade, still not enough -> damn .. let me buy a dedicated server coz I've had it with all of this.

@Sabi, we already modified the configuration for SDX clients and increased their limits.

Now let's take another point of view. What if the server gets overloaded or even goes down because of a website with bad scripts or high traffic. Who is to be blamed, us the sysadmins or the client that owns that website ? CloudLinux has been installed to prevent these issues. If your website is hitting that limit you should definitely consider upgrading on a higher plan. How to choose the right plan? We are here for you, just ask!

Let's talk a bit about a VPS. For example a VPS with 1GB of ram. You will probably ask to have cPanel installed. Now let's cut a bit from this 1GB as cPanel will use some ram to start it's services. What about pop3/imap/mysql/apache ? Ok .. let's cur more ram as these services are also using the memory. What about the OS ? Let's cut even more ram as the kernel/services will need it. With other words, you will practically won't have 1GB of ram for your website, so adding just 370MB of ram and buy a vps is not one of the best choices.



If you don't trust the admins that are keeping your website online .. there is no point on arguing which plans are the best for you.

PS: All i've written above is my opinion as a forum admin, not the opinion of a sysadmin working here.

[Scotty]

Thanks for al the great feedback and I have taken everyone's suggestions to heart.

But, why not have a 2nd tier SDX, with half the users at twice the cost. The revenue for the host would be the same but customers would have more options. It may even be less expensive for the host because of fewer clients to deal with on those 2nd tier SDX servers. It would seem to me to be a win-win.

Unless I'm misunderstanding something, my options now appear to be a $20.00 limited SDX or a $97 hybrid, with nothing in between.

[the_ancient]

Thanks for al the great feedback and I have taken everyone's suggestions to heart.

But, why not have a 2nd tier SDX, with half the users at twice the cost. The revenue for the host would be the same but customers would have more options. It may even be less expensive for the host because of fewer clients to deal with on those 2nd tier SDX servers. It would seem to me to be a win-win.

Unless I'm misunderstanding something, my options now appear to be a $20.00 limited SDX or a $97 hybrid, with nothing in between.

JPC is the only host I know of that even has a "SDX" style plan (I am sure there is others as there are a million hosting companies out there but ....) so it is not a popular package being sold by other companies

Most just give you a the Options of Shared/VPS/Dedicated, or Shared/CloudVM

[the_ancient]

Posted twice for some reason

[Scotty]

JPC is the only host I know of that even has a "SDX" style plan (I am sure there is others as there are a million hosting companies out there but ....) so it is not a popular package being sold by other companies

Most just give you a the Options of Shared/VPS/Dedicated, or Shared/CloudVM

And that is exactly the reason I came to JPC low those many years ago. They dared to be different and they offered the resources I needed at the price point I could afford.

In business, simply following the pack doesn't differentiate you from all the rest. Daring to be different is what sets one apart.

My suggestion was a two tiered SDX or on the flip side, a two tiered Hybrid plan (half the price with twice the users).

I'm simply suggesting there should be a middle of the road plan somewhere between the $20.00 (cloudlinux) SDX and the $100 hybrid.

[FreeFall]

But, why not have a 2nd tier SDX, with half the users at twice the cost. The revenue for the host would be the same but customers would have more options. It may even be less expensive for the host because of fewer clients to deal with on those 2nd tier SDX servers. It would seem to me to be a win-win.

Actually I disagree. Why? I think that the SDX should be powerful enough, and when you need that much more power then you will *need* the Hybrid. That has always been my mindset, because I have previously had an SDX which I outgrew, and I know that yeah I did need something bigger, but that was when I was using a lot of bandwidth, had lots of users (running a forum). I accepted that I needed to go to the next step. Back then there was no such thing as Hybrid, not even VPS, I had to go dedicated. That meant a huge cost, but also a server to handle on my own which presented even bigger problems. I'd of begged for a Hybrid then!

The problem will set in if there is a huge gulf between a "lesser" SDX of today in comparison with the old SDX, and then being advised that you need more power and needing to move to a Hybrid. There has to be a real difference between the standard web hosting, moving up to SDX, moving up to Hybrid. I don't think you need a 2nd tier because we have it, that is what SDX is. If you have a $40 plan then what about a $60 one, an $80 one, etc.?

If your website is hitting that limit you should definitely consider upgrading on a higher plan

This is the reason I am worried with these limits. So, what you are saying is that because my site occasionally hits the limit which are set, which could be for a few seconds, I need a bigger plan? My average RAM over a 24 hour period works out at 2.4mb(that's two-point four, not 24)...If you are telling me an SDX plan is not good enough you are saying more about the SDX than my usage. As a sys admin you recommend I upgrade? As a forum owner you would be happy to be moved to a bigger plan if you averaged 2.4mb?

[Vin DSL]

Actually I disagree. Why? I think that the SDX should be powerful enough, and when you need that much more power then you will *need* the Hybrid. [...]

"Powerful" is a tricky word...

I read this whole thread -- didn't study it, mostly because I've been there, done it. I've been in the same position as the OP many, many, times. It's a sinking feeling! Sh!t, gotta get off my butt and do something type of feeling...

My site(s) haven't changed in years... or have they?!?!? What could have happened? Nothing has changed. Really?

How about a SYN flood (gross example)? Site didn't change, did it? But, the fact of the matter is, it's bringing down a "powerful" machine to its knees.

In my case, every time my level of service has increased, here at JagPC, it allowed my site(s) to become more powerful, .e.g. more popular. And, after a while, the popularity is what brings down the server. My "powerful" trumps their "powerful" every time, or so it would seem.

It's a vicious circle, this balance of powers!

SDX is a powerhouse. Why did I get kicked off of it?!?!? Too many connections, from too many places, all at the same time. Put another way, the powerful SDX server I was on wasn't even breathing hard, because my site(s) were using up all the connections, so nobody could get into the other site(s) on the powerful server. It was the powerful users fault, not my powerful site(s), or the powerful server.

This kind of stuff always comes as a shock. Huh? Wha? Who? I didn't do anything to my site(s)? What are you talking about... you had to shut down my site(s) because I was bringing down the powerhouse?

I'm on Hybrid 100 right now... another more "powerful" server. Makes SDX look like Tinkerbell. I don't use 10% of its capabilities, but I know it's only a matter of time before my site(s) bring it down. They always do... then it's on to dedi or colo, I guess.

I don't know what the answer is. I gotta be one of the biggest a**holes on the web, but I just keep getting more powerful.

Maybe I'll change my nick, or something...

Anyway, I'm digressing now, so I'll stop. The larger point is, if "they" tell you you're bringing down a server here, they aren't trying to trick you into buying a more "powerful" service. They just want to empower you. If you don't think YOU are worth the extra money, fine. But, you're probably missing a golden opportunity to expand your horizons.

Bottom line is, you're probably a victim of your own success -- you've become too powerful for the level of service you're on. Happens all the time. Deal with it!

[FreeFall]

Before I start I will say that Jag have increased it's limits on the SDX's since this thread was originally made

I read this whole thread -- didn't study it, mostly because I've been there, done it. I've been in the same position as the OP many, many, times. It's a sinking feeling! Sh!t, gotta get off my butt and do something type of feeling...

if "they" tell you you're bringing down a server here

you've become too powerful for the level of service you're on

Actually You are wrong on this one Vin. You have not been there before, in fact none of us at Jag have. This is a new thing, this is limiting the SDX which previously did not happen. This is not about bringing down a server. This thread seems to have been mis-read by a few, and many points missed. It looks like some are thinking it is "clients who need to move because they have huge sites bigger than Facebook and are bringing the servers and bringing the network down are complaining for no reason" when in fact there is nothing further from the truth. I have read your topics before, how your site grew too big, bringing down servers etc. and you moved to Hybrid. But my site has never brought down a server, because it is not big enough (yet). One day maybe it will be, and maybe then I will take the next step, but I believe in terms of visitors/bandwidth, I should be far, far, from that (based on around 8-9 years of having SDX's here).

The I cannot speak for the OP because I don't know his usage, but for me I may agree with the "SDX isnt what it used to be" title. In January this year my site was more than 2x as busy, and I had no cause for concern. Now (before the limit got increased) my visitors see an internal server error (server too busy) which is not at all good.

I have 2 SDX accounts, in reality I could probably get away with 2 'standard' accounts here or elsewhere. I chose the SDX because I was able to afford them, I wanted extra resources should I need them, better reliability and peace of mind. These are the biggest plus points of the SDX, please don't take them away If you do then not only does it make the SDX a lesser option, but if having a 2mb average RAM useage is too much for the SDX what does it say for the 'standard' web package?!?

thanks

[Ron]

You're not alone. I understand you and your issue completely!

We talked about it in the other similar thread:
Resource Usage In Cpanel (SDX) Details?

[Vin DSL]

Actually You are wrong on this one Vin. You have not been there before, in fact none of us at Jag have. This is a new thing, this is limiting the SDX which previously did not happen. This is not about bringing down a server. [...]

Fair enough. But, let me put it to you this way...

I know how it feels to have a site shut down. It's happened to me several times, and nothing else compares. I can tell you exactly where I was, every time it happened - just like when JFK and John Lennon were murdered, or the Twin Towers were brought down.

That's what I was talking about! I can totally relate to the whole sinking feeling you get, as your online world comes crashing down around you. And, in your mind's eye, it's all a big mistake. You didn't do anything to bring this about. Nothing on your site has changed. It's got to be a big mistake. Then, the paranoia sets in, like, "Aha! I get it now. They're trying to screw me... suck every last dollar out of my pocket, which I don't have."

Believe me... been there... done it! That's all I am saying.

Now... the question becomes, what do you do about it?!?!?

You can sit in your Valley of Weeping, surrounded by pools of tears, or you can pick yourself up and fight your way to the other side.

JagPC will walk you through it, if you give them a chance. It isn't the end of the world. It just seems that way.

They'll plug you into another monster machine, and life will be beautiful again.

The only problem is... there's always another valley ahead! LoL!

Such is life on the web...